I thought we were doing ai now
Is there any way we can get this slide on the block chain?
You want an NFT, I can get you an NFT…
Yeah but can you make a bunch of them so I can sell it multiple times?
no-no, we’ll sell them in different colors. You need perceived scarcity. Add in some nostalgia, maybe some Shirttales characters wearing it on their clothes…
Can someone explain this joke in programmer terms?
I just wrote an AI that is trained to classify image patterns and automatically creates bitmasks based on the pattern distributions. We tried k-means clustering and got garbage. How would I have done that without AI?
Yeah, the joke is that every company is trying to ram LLMs and Agentic LLMs into everything without thinking about what they’re trying to accomplish. Like the trend with blockchain a decade ago.
Yours is a valid use case for ai. That’s why it doesn’t fit the meme.
But the meme is making the more extreme claim that no uses exist, so any counterexamples mean it’s untrue. Not the best way of criticizing companies that don’t know or care what a technology is good for imo.
the meme is making the more extreme claim that no uses exist
Only if you take it literally instead of as a joke that is exaggerating for comedic effect.
That’s difficult when there are lots of people who will say that and be serious about it. No way to know if it’s hyperbole.
If only there was a clue… like this being posted in programmer_humor.
Okay, but, devils advocate:
What if I’m a billionaire trying to crush the working class and accelerate climate change and political division so the class war doesn’t pop off before i can get to my climate bunker?
Or a billionaire fascist who wants to sloppify everyone’s brains and increase alienation while annihilating interiority so people will become docile and the class war won’t pop off and we get the 1984 timeline?
Or a billionaire asshole who wanted to murder a concept and settled on ‘truth’?
Or a really big ‘infinite jest’ fan?
So “ai” has a lot of use cases. Maybe dont be such a reflexive reactionary fucking Luddite piece of shit about it.
That’s the thing, AI is an exceptional propaganda machine. Blockchain isn’t really exceptional at anything - it’s just a reinvention of the wheel.
Blockchain solves a specific problem: safe transactions without a trusted authority.
It has a lot of downsides to solve this problem without a trusted authority, so in any case where you can use a trusted authority (for example a central server) it’s much better to use that instead of a blockchain.
So everyone who added blockchains to their projects gained all the downsides while never having the problem it was meant to solve in the first place.
AIs, and I assume you meant LLMs with that, are a different breed. LLMs are new: never before could a computer handle natural language to such a degree.
Problem is, that it’s still new. So no one knows what the “killer applications” are or what monetization should look like, or what the laws about it will be.
People just throw every against the wall and see what sticks… And hope for AGI/ASI and to be on the side that rides that nearly infinite potential to the moon.
Or, you know, crash and burn in case AI reaches a wall/diminishing returns/systemic problems that can’t be fixed.
We will see.
Blockchain is an adequate solution to a problem that already has other, cheaper solutions.
AI is an adequate solution to a problem that has no other similarly adequate solutions (classification of complex information). Unfortunately, all the money is in that solution being applied to problems where it’s not adequate (content generation, user interaction).
AI is an adequate solution to a problem that has no other similarly adequate solutions (classification of complex information).
Sentiment analysis machines and such have been around before LLMs and eat much less electricity.
LLMs taken over the “AI” label so much that any success from a machine learning context is attributed to it, while it actually defunds and kills research out of ML all into LLMs.
It’s true that LLMs (and GANs) are taking over a term that contains a lot of other stuff, from fuzzy logic to a fair chunk of computer linguistics.
If you look at what AI does, however, it’s mostly classification. Whether it’s fitting imprecise measurements into categories or analyzing waveform to figure out which word it represents regardless of diction and dialect; a lot of AI is just the attempt at classifying hard to classify stuff.
And then someone figure out how to hook that up to a Markov chain generator (LLMs) or run it repeatedly to “recognize” an image in pure noise (GANs). And those are cool little tricks but not really ones that solve a problem that needed solving. Okay, I’ll grant that GANs make a few things in image retouching more convenient but they’re also subject to a distressingly large number of failure modes and consume a monstrous amount of resources.
Plus the whole thing where they’re destroying the concept of photographic and videographic evidence. I dislike that as well.
I really like AI when used for what it’s good at: Taking messy input data and classifying it. We’re getting some really cool things done that way and some even justify the resources we’re spending. But I do agree with you that the vast majority of funding and resources gets spent on the next glorified chatbot in the vague hope that this one will actually generate some kind of profit. (I don’t think that any of the companies who are invested in AI still actually believe their products will generate a real benefit for the end user.)
Blockchain is an adequate solution to a problem that already has other, cheaper solutions.
There is no other solution for creating a shared, permissionless database.
Yes and no one but crypto needs that. Everyone else is much better served with traditional databases.
Right. We’ve tried to slay ‘truth’ before and nothing else has worked. Weve tried to end consciousness before, and we came up with a solution in the 40s but everyone was too chicken shit to use it, so we had to build something nastier.
Blockchain is good if you want everyone to know who you send your money to.
Which sounds stupid, but if we used it more for things that aren’t stupid money, perhaps we could find something where transparency and permanent immutable logs are a good thing. For currency those may even be bad things because privacy. Which Monero solves and that’s actually another useful thing - ability to make untraceable payments remotely. Used to have to use cash for that.
permanent immutable logs
My understanding of current blockchain technology is that it’s only permanent so long as someone is online maintaining the block integrity. If enough machines go down, or if enough machines come up that refute it, then anyone can push an alternate history.
A Bitcoin heist where you install a false ledger using a botnet.
False.
How do you modify a transaction that occurred 100 blocks ago? You’d have to also modify the 99 other blocks since that modification. But for those new blocks to be valid you need to find the new magic number that brings the hash below a certain threshold, 99 times. But there aren’t enough machines.
It assumes that the stakes are high enough for there to be a significant network online, yes. You could of course still compare your local history to the online one but by then the technology has failed its purpose.
The stakes may not be high for me but if it has value to someone, all I have to do is build my bot net and then hold their ledger ransom.
Bitcoin would be fantastic to force businesses to be taxed under a clear ledger.
Snap, Atomic, whatever…
Well yeah, but as a private citizen, I don’t want MY spending transparent to everyone like that
Now businesses? Yeah would be nice
No, I get it. You can see where I’m from here.
Ah right, I was on mobile and Voyager doesn’t show instance addresses by default lol
There are a couple of good uses of blockchain, not only currency, but yea
What’s the original invention you’re thinking of?
I struggle to think of anything where it’s the best system, that’s true. Even crypto works better other ways.
Blockchain is primarily touted as a replacement for currency.
Ah. Well, it has the advantage over cash that you can’t counterfeit it, and the advantage (or “advantage” depending on who you ask) over wire transactions that no central authority controls it.
I’ve also heard people mention Merkle trees, which are an old concept of which blockchains are a special case, but nobody thought to use them for Byzantine-fault-tolerant networks until Bitcoin.
Every decade has at least one of these buzzwords (multimedia, internet/ online, social media, mobile app, blockchain, cryptocoins, micropayment, delivery, ai,…)… They can be used to attract dumb investor’s money but they have their useful sides too.
Ok. They are just buzzwords which outline a set of tools. They are worthless without a realizable concept with a benefit for the end-user. And the use of the right tool for the job. So, I’m not sure about useful cryptocoins and blockchain use cases (I wouldn’t count financial speculation as particularly useful).
Every time somebody starts raving about some tech, it’ll turn out to be a classic hype cycle.
This isnt productive, and the hype is the largest I have ever seen. Ireland–a wealthy developed tech savvy nation–isnt building new homes to address their housing crisis because this shit is taking all the energy and water.
That’s true. The tech bros are playing the market by blowing bubble after bubble and raising the stakes each time.
Gotta ask what the supervillain-ass end game is.
Some think they can crash everything, burn it to the ground, to then rebuild it according to their designs.
That graph is peak bullshit.
Just because you believe the hype, it doesn’t mean there’s a milder use case for your application.
Unfortunately LLM do have one profitable application: generating spam and astroturfing
“According to this chart we made up without any explanation, blockchain and nfts and metaverse are going to be pretty useful tools in the future. Just because they were trendy once.”
Just to point but…
Nothing is stopping that first billionaire to run to their climate bunker right now. It’s currently way better than it will be during the disaster.
And making people dumber is an almost certain way to make them more violent too.
The odds are good some of them are thinking exactly like you pointed. But that would be because they are dumb.
Violent but not united against them.
We can dig up a bunker right now.
They’re all some mixture of stupid and insane.
—> Yes. —> No, you don’t.
Even I know that.
A surprisingly high number of techbros doesn’t though.
Tech bros using every buzzword to sound smart after they just lost tousands
That’s because they’re fucking idiots.
Ok I will do a image recognition software using if else.
That was done with neural networks way before LLM hypetrain?
AI is not just LLM
Yeah, they’re complaining about a technicality. Using the word “AI” to refer to LLMs or to generative AI is just common parlance. That definition changes every few years. Five years ago, neural networks were referred to as “AI” and a few decades ago, the AIs stealing our jobs were calculators. This is known as the AI effect.
Among experts, “AI” describes a whole research field with a myriad of applications, of which image recognition is definitely one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_intelligence
I made money odd BTC and that’s it.
Whatever vision they had, it’s not fucking happening. Web3 being pushed by those altcoins is bullshit. It’s so totally unnecessary.
So I’m clear, does blockchain always refer to those *coin currencies? Or is it be used for other purposes too?
It can be used for other purposes. It’s essentially a digital ledger that keeps track of all the transactions.
Donkey Shame!
Sure, you could use it for that if you so desired.
Imagine you have a database, you decide to add something to it and now you have to solve 5000 sudokus. Also you can’t remove anything as well. Have fun
cannot remove anything is a feature, it prevents people from changing history (imagine being able to undo all your outgoing payments)
And the reason you have to solve 5000 sudoku is by proving you have a limited resource, in this case processing power (and proof of stake makes it the money you have and skip the 5000 sudokus). Because if you are identifying people by a user account, there’s nothing stopping 1 person from creating 20 billion accounts.
Imagine many entities have a shared database. You cannot trust anyone else but you have to add something. The consensus mechanism of the algorithm of your choice ensures that only good actors participate through sheer game theory. This naturally has a cost and you are happy to pay it. You have a lot of fun
Thank you for this. I’ve grown too tired of explaining it after the last 15 years.
Just because it’s not the solution for everything doesn’t mean it’s not a solution for something. Blockchain revolutionized global finance.
I do understand what blockchains are; my question is more to whether they are used outside of cryptocurrencies or not.
~I do also like your explanation.~
This is just plain wrong. Blockchain is not a synonym for cryptocurrency or proof-of-work.
Grifters ruin everything and this reply is a perfect example
can be used for AI
I hate this so much because it’s absolutely false. Nobody needs cryptocurrency. But Blockchain has very real value that has nothing to do with currency, grift, or “proof of work”. Blockchain is NOT synonymous with crypto and the fact that everyone believes it is shows exactly how much damage the grifters have done :(
EDIT: Haters gonna hate. Hope everyone who down-votes reads the replies too.
EDIT 2: Here you go, everybody. I did the research for you…
Supply chain management
- Food safety: Companies like Walmart and IBM Food Trust use blockchain to track food products from their source to the store shelf. This allows for a swift, precise response to contamination by tracing affected items, potentially saving lives and reducing waste.
- Logistics and shipping: Shipping giant Maersk has partnered with IBM to create TradeLens, a blockchain platform that digitizes and automates shipping documents and processes. This increases transparency and efficiency across the global supply chain.
Healthcare and medical records
- Secure data sharing: Blockchain can create a secure, interoperable system for storing and sharing patient medical records. Patients can use private keys to control who accesses their sensitive data, ensuring privacy while allowing authorized providers to get the information they need.
- Pharmaceutical tracking: The MediLedger Project uses blockchain to secure the pharmaceutical supply chain, verifying the integrity of drugs and reducing the risk of counterfeit medications.
- Clinical trial management: Platforms like TrialSite use blockchain to record clinical trial data securely and transparently. This helps maintain the integrity of results, building greater trust among researchers, regulators, and participants.
Government and public services
- Land and property records: The government of Georgia has used blockchain to secure land and property records, creating an immutable and transparent public record. This reduces fraud and ensures the integrity of land titles.
- Voting systems: The mobile voting platform Voatz uses a blockchain-based system to enable secure, transparent mobile voting for eligible service members and travelers abroad. This provides a resilient solution against fraud and data corruption.
Finance (non-crypto) and banking
- Efficient transaction processing: Financial institutions like the Singapore Exchange Limited are using blockchain to streamline interbank payments. This reduces manual reconciliation and enables more efficient processing of thousands of transactions.
- Supply chain finance: TradeIX uses blockchain to provide a transparent platform for supply chain finance, automating processes and streamlining transactions.
Education
- Credential verification: Learning Machine uses blockchain for the secure issuance of digital diplomas and credentials. This provides a more trustworthy and efficient method for verifying academic achievements.
Intellectual property and media
- Transparent ticketing: Companies like Guts use blockchain to create a transparent ticketing ecosystem that eliminates ticket fraud and the secondary ticket market.
Energy and utilities
- Peer-to-peer energy trading: Homeowners with solar panels can use blockchain-based platforms to automatically sell their excess energy to neighbors. Smart meters record the transactions on a blockchain, automating the entire process.
I see this kind of comment on pretty much every thread about Blockchain, and yet those commenters aren’t ever able to share a use case where Blockchain solves a problem better than the existing technology. Maybe you have one though?
Sure do! Quoting my other reply:
Immutable ledger for inter-branch bank transaction synchronization.
This is already in use at multiple financial institutions with significant value. It has increased the speed at which transactions can be verified and distributed across large networks of bank branches so that, for example, when you deposit your money at one bank branch it becomes available elsewhere on the network immediately without waiting for the end-of-day ledger reconciling. Previously, banks had to send just the transaction details and trust that it would be valid during reconciling (the “pending” status).
Want some more?
EDIT: Took the liberty of adding a bunch of examples to my original reply 👍
Sweet, genuinely thank you, my question came from a place of genuine curiosity and honest skepticism, so I appreciate the detail. I have a follow up question though. Most of those use cases seem like they’d require linking a specific identity to a given blockchain transaction. How does one go about doing that?
Show one use case of Blockchain outside cryptocurrency. It must also be a better solution than a traditional database.
Immutable ledger for inter-branch bank transaction synchronization.
This is already in use at multiple financial institutions with significant value. It has increased the speed at which transactions can be verified and distributed across large networks of bank branches so that, for example, when you deposit your money at one bank branch it becomes available elsewhere on the network immediately without waiting for the end-of-day ledger reconciling. Previously, banks had to send just the transaction details and trust that it would be valid during reconciling (the “pending” status).
Want some more?
EDIT: Went ahead and added several examples to my original reply. 👍
I’d go the other way. Crypto has uses, and crypto works better when built on other Byzantine-resilient systems.
Most of your examples still would work better with a conventional database, because there’s an obvious trusted party and/or privacy needs.
Of course, if there’s a trusted party a conventional database is better. But that’s like saying that umbrellas are useless because it’s often sunny outside. Having or not consensus (or a trusted party) is usually not a choice, it’s an imposition. Conflicting interests exist and it’s difficult to work around them.
Using Blockchain in these situations provides clear advantages. The whole point is removing the need for trusted parties in yes scenarios because it introduced significant risk. Centralization has implicit dangers.
It can, but with something like a utility distribution there’s going to be centralisation anyway for practical, even graph-theoretic purposes. Trying to manage electricity sales over a line that someone in particular maintains with a decentralised system is a little silly.
That’s true to lesser degrees with other legal rights, which a sovereign government enforces, or in other scale industrial supply chains.
Even with something like diplomas, you kind of imply a gatekeeper to access to the chain existing. If I can issue myself a degree it’s basically an NFT market. If not, you have centralisation of some kind again, and you’ve just invented a more complicated way for Harvard to run an https API.
And hey, cryptocurrency also has utility outside speculative markets and grifters!
It can be used to move money freely and often times more efficiently, and some of it can be used for private payments, too. Ability to financially support someone anonymously is important for democracy.
It also allows you to get money directly without revealing sensitive payment information or relying on third party with giant fees. This is objectively good!
yup, the buying drugs part is the legit good use of crypto. Always cringe when people acts like that’s a negative when saying that’s their only use.
